Marc is professor emeritus of Ecology & Evolutionary Biology at the University of Colorado, Boulder. He has published 31 books, won many awards for his research on animal behavior, animal emotions, compassionate conservation, & animal protection, has worked closely with Jane Goodall, & is a former Guggenheim Fellow. Marc’s latest books are “Canine Confidential: Why Dogs Do What They Do” & “Unleashing Your Dog: A Field Guide to Giving Your Canine Companion the Best Life Possible” (with Jessica Pierce) & he also publishes regularly for Psychology Today. Marc & Jessica have recently written “A Dog’s World” about what the world will be like for dogs as & when humans disappear (Princeton University Press, 2021). In 1986 Marc won the Master’s age-graded Tour de France. His homepage is https://marcbekoff.com/.

In these Sentientist Conversations we talk about the two most important questions: “what’s real?” & “what matters?”

Sentientism is “evidence, commitment & compassion for all sentient beings.”

The audio is also on our Podcast – subscribe here on Apple: ​ (& here for all the other platforms).

We discuss:

• Growing up in Brooklyn & not being a strong student in high-school
• Talking to a companion goldfish & the neighbourhood animals
• Imagining perpectives of non-human animals: “Minding animals”
• Seeming bizarre to question the sentience of non-human animals
• Selling records, undergrad degree, then a career using play behaviour as a window into the animal perspective
• Michael Fox’s work with canids & becoming his grad student
• Nagel’s “What is it like to be a bat?”
• Donald Griffin’s “The question of animal awareness” & “Animal Minds”
• Animal protection as a lifelong focus
• Getting academics out of the clouds and into helping
• Growing up in a culturally Jewish home with Russian Jewish immigrant grandparents, but being an atheist from day one
• My parents never called me “nuts” when I said good morning to the goldfish every day
• “People ask which school of philosophy I follow – I have no idea”
• An identification with other sentient beings
• “I just never made that divide between human & non-human”
• Refusing to dissect or experiment on animals in school, as an undergrad & at med school
• Going “cold tofu” & cutting out animal products. Vegetarian then vegan
• The moral value of sentient beings & non-sentient living things
• “I don’t think plants can feel pain in an aversive way”
• “If we find out carrots feel pain, I won’t eat carrots”
• “We know certain things about sentience in non-human animals & that is enough for people to change their meal plans”
• “I never doubted that non-human animals had feelings” (Luna barks in agreement)
• Anthropocentric environmentalism that ignores farmed & most wild animals
• New Zealand’s “War on Wildlife” re: “non-native” species
• Granting rights to rivers & rocks
• Instrumental importance can still be very important
• Compassionate Conservationism: “every individual matters” so work out solutions for all sentient stakeholders
• So much welfare legislation excludes most suffering animals
• Standard conservation: “We don’t need you because there are plenty of others of your species”!
• Taking the perspective of the oppressed individual
• Being indoctrinated away from naturalism & compassion for sentients
• How even otherwise careful thinkers remain trapped by harmful social norms
• “Friends think I’m crazy but I am optimistic”
• The OneHealth movement – it’s a win win for human and non-human animals together
• Better ethics re: non-humans will improve our ethics re: other humans
• From “I know they suffer but I love my burger” to “It’s who you eat, not what you eat”
• Sentientist language, moving from object to subject language re: non-humans (Microsoft grammar checking)
• Food as a particularly emotive topic. People want to retain choice + control
• Even human supremacists should go vegan
• Ethical arguments don’t drive enough change, but other pressures are building too (climate, zoonosis, anti-microbial resistance, human health)
• “What we do to help non-humans helps humans”
• Setting an example: Biking 400km on a vegan meal plan
• Sentientism means having compassion even for people we disagree with
• “I feel for human suffering too”
• “There will be a sea change… we’re on a trajectory towards our moral compass being inclusive of non-humans and humans.. it’s a win win for all”
• We’ve made progress in the last 50y
• “We’re alive right now so just go do it”.

Sentientism is “Evidence, reason & compassion for all sentient beings.” More at https://sentientism.info/​​​​​​​. Join our “wall” https://sentientism.info/wall/
​ using this simple form: https://sentientism.info/im-a-sentientist.
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Thanks to Graham for his post-prod work. Follow him: @cgbessellieu​.